Elton John and Brandi Carlile on Co-Writing and Recording Title Song for His ‘Never Too Late’ Documentary: ‘It Feels Like a New Beginning’

Elton John harbors a strong resistance to living in the past, so even though the new documentary “Elton John: Never Too Late” is filled with retrospective glories, it made sense that he would want the film to go out on a brand new song. Or, as the case may be, a Brandi new song. Brandi Carlile saw the film and was moved to write the words that would give the doc not just a title song but a title — becoming his brown dirt cowgirl, as it were, for the simple task of encapsulating his entire state of being, at this mellowing but still-unretired stage of his life.

In taking on that mission, she went where other lyricists would fear to tread… with the exception, of course, of actual brown dirty cowboy Bernie Taupin, who is credited as a co-writer on the track along with producer Andrew Watt. John looked over these verses and quickly came up with a typically elegant melody, which he and Carlile recorded as an uplifting duet. The resulting song is now available on music streaming services (see the YouTube lyric video, below) as well as over the end credits of the film, which opens in select theaters today and streams on Disney+ Dec. 13.

These two reconvened on Zoom with Variety to talk through the background and making of the song, their first real collaboration after a two-decade mutual fandom and friendship. Naturally, “Never Too Late” will figure into the awards conversation, since things went rather well the last time Elton co-wrote a song to close out a film about his life. (That’d be “(I’m Gonna) Love Me Again,” penned for “Rocketman” and the winner of the 2020 best original song Oscar.). Regardless of outcomes there, fans of either artist can be pleased at hearing this first-time marriage of their distinctive musical and lyrical sensibilities.

It’s a beautiful song full of emotion and sentiment, without being unduly sentimental — that is, it’s kind of got its tough side, too. To ask the chicken-and-the-egg question: Was this assignment writing, coming up with a tune to fit the film’s title, or was the reverse true?

Elton John: Well, Brandi and Catherine and her girls come to visit us every year in the south of France, and David (Furnish) showed them an early cut of the documentary. Unbeknownst to me, she started writing a lyric for what she thought would be a good song for the documentary, and I had no idea she was writing it until she came up with the finished thing. I was thrilled with the lyric, and I was thrilled that she wrote it because she was inspired by what she saw. Do I have that right, Brandi?

Brandi Carlile: Of course, Elton, yeah. I watched that documentary and I was so blown away by it and kind of brought to tears. But I think it’s funny that you mentioned the thing about it being tough, because I think one of the really cool and interesting things about Elton is he’s so incredibly tough, and based on what I’d seen, I wanted to write this song that just showed his tenacity and perseverance and constant commitment to just overcome.

Elton, is there any special meaning for you in having a duet close the film and not something you’re singing on your own?

John: Seeing as Brandi wrote the lyrics and I’ve been such a fan of her for over 20 years, I just thought it would be great to do a duet. Because it’s not just my perspective; it’s someone else’s perspective. You know, when I saw the words “You are an iron man, baby,” I said, “What do you mean, I’m an iron man, baby?” You said, “Well, you survived everything you’ve been through.” … The lyrics are so beautiful. “We’ll go dancing in graveyards…” I hadn’t written a song to Brandi’s lyrics ever, so I was very inspired. And Bernie was in on the case, as was Andrew Watt, who produced the track. Bernie was kind of the surrogate non-writer on this, but Brandi loves Bernie so much, she said, “I’ve got to include Bernie in this somehow.” So all four of us kind of chipped in, in a way; Bernie approved and loved the lyric.

And it was a great title for the documentary, because it had a different title, originally. It was called “Farewell Yellow Brick Road,” which is really boring. “Never too late” — that’s what the documentary is about. … It was a lovely experience, and a new experience for me, because after I finished the “Farewell Yellow Brick Road” tour, I wanted to move forward and try different things. And this is the first step of trying a different thing, writing with someone else, and making an album, eventually, with Andrew Watt.

Carlile: It was wild setting a lyric down in front of Elton John for the first time that I had written and watch him write it. It was absolutely surreal. And I mean, the thing about Bernie that so influenced my ability to do this, and why I think in the end it became a collaboration, is because Elton doesn’t like saying nice things about himself. It’s OK for other people to say ’em, but you sort of have to write it for him to communicate it. So I had to write the song for him to sing about himself… He doesn’t do it in conversations, either. So I just think it’s really true to our relationship. And our relationship is a little bit modeled on the relationship that he has with my other hero, Bernie, because Bernie wrote lyrics about Elton for Elton to sing. Some of them were really nice and some of them were a little bit critical, and he sang them anyway. There’s just something about, again, the toughness of Elton’s ability to communicate other people’s thoughts about him that is kind of fucking brilliant.

One part of the song says, “Darling, don’t bore me with the same old tired story. What’s new in the news? Who’s hot? Where’s the glory? Only dwell in the past for laughing at time. Don’t the years make jokes of all of us?” That made me think of the part of the film where Elton is recording his Rocket Hour radio show and so interested in new acts and not just listening to stuff that came out 50 years ago.

Carlile: Yeah. And not just new acts, but, like, “What’s going on?” Like, “What’s the goss?” That’s every phone call with Elton. It’s how you’ve always lived your life, Elton. It’s like, “Ah, don’t bore me with the past. What’s new?”

John: What’s new? That’s what I want to know. … I love the past. It’s in my brain, but I don’t want to deal with it. I don’t go home and listen to (vintage material). Unless it’s maybe a Nina Simone moment or a Billie Holiday moment or a Miles Davis moment, it very rarely happens. I’m more interested in what’s going on now, and there’s so much good stuff going on now that doesn’t get played on the radio. So that’s what I think my job is when I do the Rocket Hour: to have these people on the program, to play the records and then phone them up and say, “I love your record.” And that’s how you get Allison Ponthier and the Linda Lindas in on the film, because I love them, and it’s just great to talk to these new people. They give you the energy that you had when I was playing the Troubadour. And that is called adrenaline.

It’s fun that the Linda Lindas get a little moment, being immortalized in your documentary.  

John: My favorite line in the film is actually “I can’t believe I am 64 years older than the Linda Lindas’ drummer.” It just makes me laugh every time I hear it.

Talking about some of the lines that Brandi came up with for the song… it’s very twisty, the “iron man” section you were talking about, which goes into: “to hell with Heaven’s Gate.” The song acknowledges mortality and then kind of says fuck you to mortality — and/or embraces it, maybe — and at the same time is very defiant in the sense that there’s a lot of life left to live. And saying, “There’s a last time for everything, but we won’t ever know” — there is an interesting balance of things there.

John: Well, Brandi’s original line, which we couldn’t use, was “Fuck off, Heaven’s Gate.” I actually prefer “Fuck off, Heaven’s Gate”! But then you can’t really put that at the end of a movie.

Carlile: He says “fuck off” all the time. He says it all the time. [Laughter.]

It’s poignant to sing “there’s a last time for everything, but we won’t ever know.” But then part of the point of the film is, there are certain things you can plan a last time for — like the whole Dodger Stadium U.S. tour climax and putting a cap on touring altogether. Maybe there’s a balance of both, where it’s like, if you know you can’t physically do something forever, you can plan a finale. But then, apart from that, there are a lot of other things in life where it could be the last time — or it could be the 10,000th-from-last time. And this song suggests you have to see that as part of the beauty.

Carlile: Well, one time somebody told me that one day I’ll pick up my daughter and I’ll put her back down and I’ll never pick her up again — and that I won’t ever know when that is. And that sunk in to me, in the worst way. So I’m gonna pick her up until she’s 150 pounds. Or I’m never gonna stop picking her up.

John: Oh, God, yeah.

As a parent too, I’ve thought about, when was the last time that I went rolling around with her on the grass in the park and didn’t know it was the last time? It’s a good thing when you don’t know it’s the last time or you would be weeping for a week.

John: Well, our eldest boy just went to boarding school, and he left a young boy, and when we went to see him for the first time, I came back and I cried. I said, “My boy is gone. My boy has gone and he has been replaced by a young man.” And it was beautiful, but it was just… I’ll never be able to play with him like I used to. It’s part of life and it’s part of growing up, but it does affect you — and it’s wonderful. It was a wonderful feeling. It was a sad feeling, but it was also a moving on. And that’s what we all have to do.

Carlile: You’re the absolute best at that. You understand that crazy cocktail of pride and grief that’s what it is to be a parent.

Brandi, you’d had a lot of years to think about the Elton/Bernie collaboration and how that works. So, knowing that you had written this lyric and that, if all went well, there would be music to it, you had to have moments of anticipating what it might sound like. So when you are hearing what he wrote to it, what’s that like?

Carlile: It was incredibly surreal. I had a lump in my throat. You know, it took me back to being 12 years old and reading the lyrics to “Captain Fantastic,” and reading “the keyboard player’s haunted, hollow eyes” [in the song “Bitter Fingers”], and hearing Elton sing that and thinking: “Well, this isn’t very nice. It seems like maybe Bernie wrote this about Elton, and Elton has to sing it.” And then I read the whole rest of this album and I thought: “This is the most brilliant love story. This album is incredible because it’s about the man, written by a man who loves him.” And it completely changed the way I saw songwriting and lyrics, and I don’t know if we’d even be talking on the phone if I hadn’t had the liner notes to that album.

It’s things like that, that when you do put a lyric in front of Elton for the first time and he starts to write one of his iconic, classic, heart-wrenching melodies, you’re like, “Holy shit, that’s me. That’s my words. He’s writing to my words.”

John: Yeah, it was easy because the lyrics are so great and they just jump off the page. … Brandi’s lyrics, I mean, you’ve only got to listen to her own albums to know how good she is as a lyric writer. So I looked at this and it flew off my fingers. We wrote and recorded it quite quickly, and it was inspiring. I never failed to get inspired by the written word when it’s placed in front of me.

Carlile: I could tell he was inspired because he added a lyric. He added the balloons. He said, “Oh, can you say ‘You can keep your balloons’?” That’s when you know he’s engaged, when he’s even jumping in on the process. And I was like, “Absolutely. You just wrote a lyric.”

John: It was a miracle, yes!

And you wanted to credit Bernie for the inspiration he brought you from having channeled Elton for so long?

Carlile: Oh, yeah. I wouldn’t have had access to words like that without Bernie Taupin. There’s just no way. And it’s soulfully the right thing, based on this story, based on this film, based on the man and the men. Elton is a wildly individual and spectacular comet of a person, but he’s a sum of his parts, (which are) musically Elton John and Bernie Taupin — that’s one thing. And with the (Hanseroth) twins [Carlile’s collaborators from the start of her career], you know how I feel about that. You know I really honor that with my whole self.

John: So it’s my lifetime partner (Taupin), and Brandi, who has become a lifetime friend, and Andrew Watt, who is brilliant in the studio. And it was just a lovely feeling, all four of us being in the studio recording this. You know, it feels like a new beginning. Who knows? We don’t know. But anyway, this is the start of something new for me, and I’m very excited about it because, you know, I don’t want to sing “Philadelphia Freedom” anymore, really. And I don’t want to sing “Bennie and the Jets” anymore. I want to move forward.

Brandi, as we speak, you’re about to interview Chappell Roan for a program at the Grammy Museum. You are keeping a lot of good company today.

Carlile: Is there anything you want me to ask her? … Come on, man. You’re not gonna help me out?

John: Chappell Roan is my new FaceTime buddy. I FaceTimed her last night, because she was down about the election, and I said, “You know what, Chappell? You can’t do anything about it. Just do what great artists do, in times when people are bewildered —  turn to your own writing or your photography or your dancing or your acting and just turn it into art.” She’s such a great girl.

Carlile: Good for you, Elton. You’re such an inspiration to all of us.